early tailight panel hardware

[imming1965]

does anyone have a picture of correct taillight panel hardware. that goes on the four studs for the early taillight panels? picture shows where i am asking about.. thanks
   also should this lower attaching point be a screw or rivot, original holes looks like might have been a screw but could have been replaced or removed at some point by now

[JD]

Any chance you can say how early this car is?

The hardware on the 4 fiberglass studs would be large washers (to provide a contact with the swiss-cheese holes that were drilled to position the panel - see an example of another car panel holes below) and nuts of the appropriate thread hardware store stuff.

The lower-lip of the fiberglass panel would have been held to the car with screws, not rivets on an early car) to my understanding

Don't forget the strip-caulk around the perimeter of the fiberglass panel.

...and the last image, Lime-repaint car the lower "tail" of the end cap would have had screws not rivets.

I'm sure others will chime in too.

(Did you get the e-mail with the image of the grille trim?)

[Bossbill]

My outer washers on my 4 bolt panel are almost cut in half to clear the ridge on the outside. The centers are round.
But I do wonder about the finish of the washer and nut.
The nut appears to be PO with a built in washer.
The washer may have been plain/natural with no finish at all.

[Bob Gaines]

My outer washers on my 4 bolt panel are almost cut in half to clear the ridge on the outside. The centers are round.
But I do wonder about the finish of the washer and nut.
The nut appears to be PO with a built in washer.
The washer may have been plain/natural with no finish at all.

The nuts are typically PO . The washers are typically zinc silver prior to being modified in some instances .

[Bossbill]

Interesting about the washer, Bob. Mine are dull after all of these years.

How about the nut on the black, back metal panel? The one with the long stud that was then cut by SA. Is that one zinc or PO?

[imming1965]

Any chance you can say how early this car is?

The hardware on the 4 fiberglass studs would be large washers (to provide a contact with the swiss-cheese holes that were drilled to position the panel - see an example of another car panel holes below) and nuts of the appropriate thread hardware store stuff.

The lower-lip of the fiberglass panel would have been held to the car with screws, not rivets on an early car) to my understanding

Don't forget the strip-caulk around the perimeter of the fiberglass panel.

...and the last image, Lime-repaint car the lower "tail" of the end cap would have had screws not rivets.

I'm sure others will chime in too.

(Did you get the e-mail with the image of the grille trim?)

JD not a real early car more like mid production just still early panel. 1453 car number march build.

[Bob Gaines]

Interesting about the washer, Bob. Mine are dull after all of these years.

How about the nut on the black, back metal panel? The one with the long stud that was then cut by SA. Is that one zinc or PO?

There is typical and not typical .   Given the hardware used at SA was nothing special and most likely readily available how often do you see washers that do not have some kind of plating on them.At the very least phosphate . Sometimes plating if thin will disapate over time in certain conditions . I don't know if that is what you are seeing or not. If they are bare steel then I believe that they are more of a anomoliy then anything else.  Nuts used were typicaly PO . It is my belief that the all thread studs are typically plated with a thin layer of zinc . I have seen plating still visible on the threads once taken out of the housing. Just conclusions based on the many I have seen. Others may have different opinion.   

[imming1965]

would it be a standard nut or a nut that is flanged like on taillight housing mounting nuts? and does the nut need another washer because these studs are small like #12 or something so the nut would be small...

[Bob Gaines]

would it be a standard nut or a nut that is flanged like on taillight housing mounting nuts? and does the nut need another washer because these studs are small like #12 or something so the nut would be small...

Typically flanged nut on four mounting block studs. Tail light box nuts do not have a washer underneath.

[imming1965]

would it be a standard nut or a nut that is flanged like on taillight housing mounting nuts? and does the nut need another washer because these studs are small like #12 or something so the nut would be small...

Typically flanged nut on four mounting block studs. Tail light box nuts do not have a washer underneath.

I wasnt trying to imply that the taillight buckets had washer under them, i was trying to say that the four studs are very small on taillight panel and the nuts for those four studs would be small and if they were not flanged they might need another washer to not slip through the big washer hole. im sure that clarifies what i meant....hahahaha

[JD]

Is this what you're referring to?

[Bob Gaines]

would it be a standard nut or a nut that is flanged like on taillight housing mounting nuts? and does the nut need another washer because these studs are small like #12 or something so the nut would be small...

Typically flanged nut on four mounting block studs. Tail light box nuts do not have a washer underneath.

I wasnt trying to imply that the taillight buckets had washer under them, i was trying to say that the four studs are very small on taillight panel and the nuts for those four studs would be small and if they were not flanged they might need another washer to not slip through the big washer hole. im sure that clarifies what i meant....hahahaha

Those would have a large diameter washer sometimes they were notched at SA.

[Bossbill]

The second pic of the white car is interesting.

I'd heard (here?) that the pop rivets that hold the black panel to the car were installed the other way around with the pop rivet head inside of trunk.

Those studs are really long. Weren't they supposed to be cut off much closer to the nut?

The nuts on my flat taillight panel "4 studs" are a hollowed out nut with built in washer.

After seeing some of the fitment issues I brought my black panel over to my unfinished car and really wondered if they actually belonged to this car! I took them off many years ago so they do belong and  the top fit fine. But the bottom rivet holes didn't line up worth a damn. If I took off the black panel and flattened it a bit by stepping on it it would fit better!
I better prefit this before paint or I'll be in trouble later.

[Bob Gaines]

The second pic of the white car is interesting.

I'd heard (here?) that the pop rivets that hold the black panel to the car were installed the other way around with the pop rivet head inside of trunk.

Those studs are really long. Weren't they supposed to be cut off much closer to the nut?

The nuts on my flat taillight panel "4 studs" are a hollowed out nut with built in washer.

After seeing some of the fitment issues I brought my black panel over to my unfinished car and really wondered if they actually belonged to this car! I took them off many years ago so they do belong and  the top fit fine. But the bottom rivet holes didn't line up worth a damn. If I took off the black panel and flattened it a bit by stepping on it it would fit better!
I better prefit this before paint or I'll be in trouble later.

The rivets for the light boxes are installed from inside of the trunk space. SA installed longer studs initially and then cut them off after everything else was done. The long studs allowed the extra room needed to bridge all of the separate parts and then pull them together .You will find that it makes it harder to install the assembly with the re used already shortened studs .The nuts used typically had a flange head. Almost every original car I have ever seen did not make use of all of the pre drilled holes in the taillight boxes. Sometimes you will find rivets hanging in the holes but not making contact with the Mustang sheet metal. In this case if you strive for a perfect fit it will  most typically not be like the factory.

[Bossbill]

Yeah, a perfect fit with those pop rivet holes itsn't going to happen here.
Thanks!