Ford GT40 chassis XGT-2

[MSH]

Hi,
I search informations about the Alan Mann MkII chassis XGT-2.
Its history is not clear... Someone have informations about this car ? Old documents ?

Who is the current owner ? XGT-2 is in UK or USA, or... ?
The license plate is register in UK.

Thank you very much for your help!

[TA Coupe]

Best place to ask is probably here:

https://www.gt40s.com/

        Roy

[rkm]

Or ask Rex Myers.

[shelbydoug]

The ability to just attach a VIN tag with pop rivets TO ME seems problematic at best.

The comp car crowd is different in the sense that so many cars were wrecked completely and just resurrected from sometimes nothing more then a bolt from the original car would make me question the originality v authenticity of the car if I was looking to buy, which I am not.



I know of at least on MkIV that only existed as a tub and was later constructed as a complete car.
Is this the same debate as to what is a Cobra? To me that means a Shelby Cobra.

It would appear that may be what is going on here?

[cushmancomp]

Its history is crystal clear to everybody in the know. I have known the car since the early 80 and it was sitting in the same spot in the garage since early 70s at that point. Only 3 cars were ever made like it and the other 2 were well known as well

[shelbydoug]

That may be so and I am not questioning your "word".

Let me just refer you to a discussion of one of the original 427 Comp Cobras. At the moment I don't remember the specific car but it was something like CSX 3006 or CSC 3014 or one of them around there.

In that discussion I got a reply from the SAAC Cobra Registrar, and to paraphrase what he said, "I want you to know that car you are looking at now IS NOT the car that left Shelby Ameerican".

I'm just saying that this mess that you call the original car when it is finally completed, "will not be the car that left Alan Mann" or wherever.

That's all that I am saying.

It is up to the next owner/caretaker to accept that or not. To me, that car there is dead just not buried yet. Nice headers though. 

[cushmancomp]

Luckily nobody that matters asked your opinion as its one the most original tubs out there in the real GT40 world and without question in any aknowleged GT40 expert/hostorians mind.   But you go on making up your stories and I have no dog in this fight but hate seeing the uniformed spread rumors about something they probably have never even seen.

[98SVT - was 06GT]

When race cars are built - if the company has the assets - they produce more parts than they need. If the company planned on running a 2 car team it a 3rd tub makes a lot so sense. It's faster to assemble in case one of the cars is written off. It's cheaper to produce at the same time as the others.
While an unfinished factory tub does not have the soul associated with a completed/raced car it is still of the same DNA as one that does.
The fact that is was not finished in period will effect the value greatly but it will not negate the fact of where and why it was created.
As far as "it's not the Cobra that left Shelby American" I'll wager Ned was referring to one of the many known Cobras that the only original part on them is the tag rivetted to a 100% recreation.
In researching my mid 80s GT1/TransAm car I came across an interesting point. SCCA regions stamped the cages of the amateur GT1 cars after inspection. The SCCA did not stamp the cages of the Pro Series TA cars. Both cars were built to the same set of rules. My Mustang and the TA winning DeAtley Camaro chassis were both built to the same specs by the same company Speedway Engineering.  I assume it was because the chassis was considered an expendable part.

Here is a Mustang with the DNA but not the Soul: https://www.hemmings.com/stories/2014/12/12/unfinished-until-2011-the-last-bud-moore-trans-am-mustang-heads-to-auction  As expected it's auction results were poor.

[shelbydoug]

Luckily nobody that matters asked your opinion as its one the most original tubs out there in the real GT40 world and without question in any aknowleged GT40 expert/hostorians mind.   But you go on making up your stories and I have no dog in this fight but hate seeing the uniformed spread rumors about something they probably have never even seen.

I'm not making up stories. You are.

Answer the question, when that car is finished will it be the car that left the factory? We all know the answer.

If eccentric billionaires want to delude themselves who am I to deny that? You sing and dance as well as anyone but you're singing your own tune and it isn't reality. Bend it any way you want.

Here's the thing though, those same billionaires don't want to be criticized. They want everyone else to agree with them. When they don't, it can tend to effect their decisions. This is what makes complete survivors more valuable/desirable.

I could care less what the outcome is. Just don't come singing your tune to me.


As far as you not having a dog in the race, who is it exactly did you say was selling parts for the restoration? Hint...wasn't me.

[98SVT - was 06GT]

Answer the question, when that car is fionished will it be the car that left the factory? We all know the answer.

It would be easier to call this thread - What price history? Yes a "real" car but not factory built or raced - a collection of new & repro parts.

The unfinished Kar Kraft Holman & Moody Boss 302 I linked above is a very similar situation. A body in white that had floated around unfinished for 40 years. It was finished in 2011. In 2015 it went to auction and was a no sale at $140 - 70 TA Mustangs with history were fetching upwards of $400+. After the auction a deal was struck and it changed hands for $220. While legal for most vintage bodies since it didn't race in period it's not legal for the Historic Trans Am group which is where everyone wants to race them. The 2015 auction eluded to "consignor is attempting to obtain an eligibility exception from Historic Trans-Am to allow the Mustang to compete" by the 2019 auction it was well known that it could not run with that group and it sold for less than 90 grand with the fees.

[shelbydoug]

I'd put it this way. If I currently owned it, I'd want to put it back as best I can, but I see it as a wounded warrior.

I can give it artificial legs. Not it's real ones.

It's a noble endeavor to "restore it". But it's damaged goods. You just can't roll back time. That's just an illusion that evaporates quickly.

That's enough for some but it's not equal to a complete survivor...unfortunately.

...and like a "Journalist", who doesn't agree with the story that's being told to them, expressing disagreement is going to bring being disparaged, threatened and demeaned into the game and accused of "fake news!"

It does matter what a knowledgeable public thinks. Speaking truth to power is always a risk which many will shy away from. Same as it ever was I guess?

[honker]

Thought I would throw this into the mix, this is from the Alan Mann-Tony Dron book "Alan Mann, A Life Of Chance" my copy printed

2012. Be a couple of posts.

[honker]

Continuing from the Alan Mann book.