Old -vs- New Traction Masters

[Shawn]

I've restored and installed the traction master under ride bars on 1816.  The original tubes both had a slight bend that were straightened out.  My concern is will they just bend again once I start driving the car?  Are the newer tubes with the correct end marking sold by traction Master made with thicker wall tubing or will they bend up just as easily?  I don't plan on changing any of the original mounting brackets just the tubes.  With the reasonable price for the complete set and accurate tube markings I was thinking may be a good choice.  Any advise or opinion appreciated.

Shawn

[shelbydoug]

I've restored and installed the traction master under ride bars on 1816.  The original tubes both had a slight bend that were straightened out.  My concern is will they just bend again once I start driving the car?  Are the newer tubes with the correct end marking sold by traction Master made with thicker wall tubing or will they bend up just as easily?  I don't plan on changing any of the original mounting brackets just the tubes.  With the reasonable price for the complete set and accurate tube markings I was thinking may be a good choice.  Any advise or opinion appreciated.

Shawn

Yes, the original tubing is too thin. It will bend again. That's very common.

You need to replace it with 3/16" wall DOM tubing. You can get that from several sources on ebay cut to the length that you need.

It's easy to do if you can weld. The original ends get cut off, cleaned out and rewelded on the new tubing.

Check your rear leafs for cracking under the big clamp. They can crack right through the locating hole. That can be caused by the bent tube or cause it to bend.


I went one further and added an extra long top leaf like many of the R models and T/A cars did. The car rides better and level that way. Takes some of the stress off of the rest of the rear assembly.

Take the rear Konis out. Put in Cure-rides. Paint them orange if need be? You won't believe the difference with these changes.

[Shawn]

I've replace the leaf springs with a new set.  I did keep the original lower leafs with part numbers, finished correctly and used a new set of the correct bands.  I have a new set of Konis but am curious about the Cure-rides you mentioned. 

[Royce Peterson]

The problem with all Traction Masters is that they are replacing half the leaf spring with a section of tubing. Inevitably they bend because they don't flex. Or they break at a weld. Or both. It's just part of the fun, you should expect it.

[shelbydoug]

I've replace the leaf springs with a new set.  I did keep the original lower leafs with part numbers, finished correctly and used a new set of the correct bands.  I have a new set of Konis but am curious about the Cure-rides you mentioned.

To make the extra leaf rear spring work right without being choppy, you need to take the clamps off.


In '66, Shelby did a project with Cure-ride for the "drag cars". Essentially they are just a huge piston compared to stock and Konis.

Konis get there additional control from added cylinder pressure. Cure-rides just use a larger piston.
1-3/8" diameter I believe?

That makes the shock response smoother and not as radical as the Koni. Makes a great riding and handling car.


I've had the Cure-rides on the car since 1980 or so. I've never regretted it at all. For me, it is the way to go.

[Bob Gaines]

The problem with all Traction Masters is that they are replacing half the leaf spring with a section of tubing. Inevitably they bend because they don't flex. Or they break at a weld. Or both. It's just part of the fun, you should expect it.

I am not sure I understand the replacing concept. The traction masters don't replace any leafs. It bolts under the leaf spring plate in the rear and to the unibody in the front. The tubes are mounted in bushings front and rear and pivot as the leaf springs flex. Not to say that there isn't some flex stress put on them in their range of motion but typically not enough to bend.

[Bob Gaines]

I've restored and installed the traction master under ride bars on 1816.  The original tubes both had a slight bend that were straightened out.  My concern is will they just bend again once I start driving the car?  Are the newer tubes with the correct end marking sold by traction Master made with thicker wall tubing or will they bend up just as easily?  I don't plan on changing any of the original mounting brackets just the tubes.  With the reasonable price for the complete set and accurate tube markings I was thinking may be a good choice.  Any advise or opinion appreciated.

Shawn

The tubes bend more commonly because some uninformed person puts a jack under them or road trama not typically as a result of their range of motion. If that was the case every car would have that problem after 50+ years and they don't. The original tube is not that stout. If you didn't get the tubes perfectly straight I would use a thicker wall substitute tube as has been suggested and cut the ends off of the old. Don't think that you can buy the new ones from TM and expect a perfect fit. There is a possibility that they will fit but don't get your hopes up. Minor variations in mfg between then and now may complicate things .Given they are welded in the front on your car makes  any replacement to have to be a very exact in total length fit . 

[Shawn]

Thanks Bob -  Really appreciate your expertise and clarity on the subject 

[shelbydoug]

Thanks Bob -  Really appreciate your expertise and clarity on the subject

Use a thicker tube. 3/16 wall is motorcycle chassis tube.


We need a tie breaker. Ask Randy.

[gt350hr]

   To add a little bit to Bob's reply and Royce's too , under ride bars bend because they are in "compression" . The physics are "natural" motion of the differential under acceleration is OPPOSITE of tire rotation. Without traction bars this makes the front half of the spring "arc" upward and the rear half downward. Those two reactions typically cause the rear of the car to squat. Because of the "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction", the spring "unwraps " and usually causes wheel hop which traction bars usually stop. Because the axle housing is rotating in this action , the under ride bar is compressed and because the tubing is thin wall , it begins to "arc" like the spring does eventually forming a noticeable bend. Changing to thicker wall tubing will stop the bending but will also transfer the energy to the "next weak link". I have seen the forward mount welds cracked on the side closest to the leaf spring because of this. I have also seen bent spring pads on the axle housing itself.
     This does not happen on an over ride bar because the bar is in "tension". In this case the "normal" reaction is ripping the front mounting bracket out of the unibody. Guess how I know!
       Randy

[Shawn]

Thanks for information and the "week link" scenario certainly makes sense.  The original frame mounts were never removed and recall the welded area looks fine. 

[Bob Gaines]

   T add a little bit to Bob's reply and Royce's too , under ride bars bend because they are in "compression" . The physics are "natural" motion of the differential under acceleration is OPPOSITE of tire rotation. Without traction bars theis makes the front half of the spring "arc" upward and the rear half downward. Those two reactions typically cause the rear of the car to squat. Because of the "for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction", the spring "unwraps " and usually causes wheel hop which traction bars usually stop. Because the axle housing is rotating in this action , the under ride bar is compressed and because the tubing is thin wall , it begins to "arc" like the spring does eventually forming a noticeable bend. Changing to thicker wall tubing will stop the bending but will also transfer the energy to the "next weak link". I have seen the forward mount welds cracked on the side closest to the leaf spring because of this. I have also seen bent spring pads on the axle housing itself.
     This does not happen on an over ride bar because the bar is in "tension". I this case the "normal" reaction is ripping the front mounting bracket out of the unibody. Guess how I know!
       Randy

Randy,I am positive you have exposed Tracton Master bars to their worst case scenario on numerous occasions over the years .

[gt350hr]

   Right at 1,000 miles 1/4 at a time. Poor old thing. The front brackets have been re welded twice by me in my 46 years of ownership.

[6s1802]

Traction Master was still in Burbank across from the Old Lockheed plant when I got a new set of bars made because my old ones were badly bent. The guy that ran TM was great, he tack welded one end on so I could test fit the bar for a perfect fit. I also used new leafs with the half torque leaf added. No issues. I don't know if they are still there.

[2112]

^^^ I would be pleasantly surprised if they were still there.

So often the kids or grandkids liquidate, the name gets sold and production moves to China.