Ram Air on GT 500

[1968]

Was there ever a ram air setup available on the GT 500?  I think the answer is no, but I wonder why not because there was a ram air setup available on the 1967 427 8V Fairlane.

[shelbydoug]

No.

There was mention in print of it being "optional" on '68 GT350's AFTER the KR's were introduced but that was never seen and was never put into a time table of when.

I'd speculate that after the KR was introduced with the cold air ducting that someone internally suggested that it could be done on the 350 as well but I've never seen any indication that there even was any engineering done on that.

The '68 500 was too early in the timetable for it but again, there was never a timetable projected as to where in production or pre-production the ducting for the hood was developed. I don't think that the ducting ever appeared on any of the known engineering cars?

I personally never even heard of it being suggested or going as far as being tested on the '67s.



Shelby Automotive's head was in a different place then the other teams that did other projects like the 427 ram air on earlier Fords.

Ford always had something in the pot cooking somewhere else and the public just gets the impression that somehow there was some sort of master plan under Ford's direct control rather then "setting a million monkeys at a million typewriters and..."

[Bob Gaines]

There was a period ram air type accessory that you could buy from Shelby or Ford high performance that consisted of a fiberglass base and  typical oval lid along with a foam rubber seal.

[1968]

There was a period ram air type accessory that you could buy from Shelby or Ford high performance that consisted of a fiberglass base and  typical oval lid along with a foam rubber seal.

Thanks for that!  Do you happen to have a photo or a link to a photo?  I have never seen an oval one of those that would have worked with dual carbs.

[shelbydoug]

There was a period ram air type accessory that you could buy from Shelby or Ford high performance that consisted of a fiberglass base and  typical oval lid along with a foam rubber seal.

Thanks for that!  Do you happen to have a photo or a link to a photo?  I have never seen an oval one of those that would have worked with dual carbs.

It doesn't work with a 68 Shelby hood. Never even thought of trying it on a '67?

As far as I know it was adapted from the 67 R code Fairlane and requires you to cut a hole in the hood for a scoop?

There are two bases for that set up. A single 4 and a dual 4.


If we are talking about a 68 Shelby hood then you can modify a KR duct to fit the oval air cleaner. A '67 is going to need more consideration. The hood scoop is much wider.

What do you want to put it on?

[1968]

There was a period ram air type accessory that you could buy from Shelby or Ford high performance that consisted of a fiberglass base and  typical oval lid along with a foam rubber seal.

Thanks for that!  Do you happen to have a photo or a link to a photo?  I have never seen an oval one of those that would have worked with dual carbs.

It doesn't work with a 68 Shelby hood.

It's from the 67 R code Fairlane and requires you to cut a hole in the hood for a scoop.

There are two bases for that set up. A single 4 and a dual 4.


If we are talking about a 68 Shelby hood then you can modify a KR duct to fit the oval air cleaner.

What do you want to put it on?

No modification plans, I was just curious as to what was available back then and why the Fairlane got it and the Shelby did not, which was covered.  Thanks!

[Bob Gaines]

There was a period ram air type accessory that you could buy from Shelby or Ford high performance that consisted of a fiberglass base and  typical oval lid along with a foam rubber seal.

Thanks for that!  Do you happen to have a photo or a link to a photo?  I have never seen an oval one of those that would have worked with dual carbs.

It doesn't work with a 68 Shelby hood.

It's from the 67 R code Fairlane and requires you to cut a hole in the hood for a scoop.

There are two bases for that set up. A single 4 and a dual 4.


If we are talking about a 68 Shelby hood then you can modify a KR duct to fit the oval air cleaner.

What do you want to put it on?

My post was relevant to the initial 67 GT 500 question posted in this 67 350 GT 500 category and not a 68. No modifications to the hood needed when I used it on a 67 GT500 . The fiberglass base of the setup was kind of cheesy however IMO.

[shelbydoug]

OK, you got me on the 67 heading AGAIN! 

I need to measure on my '67 the size of the base plate one would need to mate to the bottom of the hood but I think it's pretty big and much larger then the R code base in the first picture.

OK, I'm back and the plate to cover the bottom of the 67 Shelby hood scoop is going to be big, something like 32"wide by 30" long. That's one BIG mama! Maybe winding up looking more like a Pontiac Trans-Am assembly to mate the two?


I'd like to see pictures of what your solution to this was Bob. I'd like to see that kit in one of those catalogs as well if possible.


It probably will need that 3" tall semi-hard foam "seal". Here's a picture of the foam that I was supplied with for the Shelby/Maier Racing kit.


These pictures indicate what you would need to do to mate to a '68 Shelby hood. A 67 would require similar modifications to the base plate but as measured that plate would be huge, but yes, it is doable.

I'd recommend that you start with a "tin" blank base plate that you can get from Branda. Use a hole saw to cut for the carbs, then at that point attach the base plate sized to the 67's hood.

Don't use the Shelby/Maier foam, use the seal that I used that attaches to the edge of your extended base plate and has a flexible/collapsible rubber bulb at the top.

It looks very similar to the seals that Ford used on the later Mustangs with ram air.

[shelbydoug]

R code base plate. Originally from Ford it was stamped steel.

This one was a repro from Maier and is fiberglass. It was originally available as a single 4 or a dual 4.

The dual 4 was made for the 427 and the carbs location in the plate is relative to how the scoop is located on the hood of the 67 427 Fairlane. That does not index correctly with the Shelbys.


Certainly in the case of my 68 350, the carb locations were significantly different and the base plate needed to be custom cut out of a blank oval plate.

Here's the pic of the single 4 R code copy on my 68 when the Boss 351 was in there. It's much too narrow to mate to the hood scoop on the 67 which is huge by comparison so don't even bother to go looking for one.


And, yes, that is the foam in the above picture. I've never found the source for it but it is likely an industrial application that is relatively obscure and probably obsolete these days?

[1968]

Wow!  Those are great photos.  What a wealth of knowledge and experience there is in this forum.

Looking around on the Internet, I saw this discussion from several years ago on fabricating the ram air setup on the Ford FE engine forum:

https://www.fordfe.com/427-fairlane-air-filter-housing-lower-half-t37490-s8520.html


Just to add to this discussion, here is an interesting post from that thread:

Since the ram-air hood was not standard on the 427 Fairlanes, there aren't that many of them out there to look at anymore. But you can certainly make a functional 'facsimile' easily enough...as long as you just want something that works, not something 'concours correct'!

With the help of any sheet metal man worthy of his pay, the easiest thing is to start with one of the normal dual-quad air cleaners. Have them cut an oval out of something like .090" aluminum sheet, about 3" longer and wider than the dual-quad air cleaner base.

Then, cut another oval out of the inside area of that one, so as to match the size of the air cleaner base...but only out to the raised lip that locates the filter element.

Use something like the Moroso No. 97070 sealing foam, which is about 1-1/2" wide x 4" high x 60" long. Trim it to length, so it fits around the circumference of the new plate. Then cut it in half, lengthwise, so it's now only 2" high (4" originally). Glue it in place with a proper foam adhesive.

Then all you do is put the dual-quad air cleaner base plate onto the carbs, and place the new hood seal plate you've made on top of that, locating it around the raised lip. Put the filter element and air cleaner top back in place, and tighten down the wing nuts securely. This 'clamps' your new hood seal plate firmly between the filter and base.

If you've correctly sized the oval cut-out in the underside of the ram air hood's plenum, your new hood seal plate will butt up against it, preventing hot underhood air from being drawn into the carbs. Then it's off to the races!

[shelbydoug]

Well, you may not agree with what I've done but you would be hard pressed to prove that I don't know anything as more then a few have suggested? 


You have to go your own way I suppose but I post these pics to help you to eliminate needless wrong turns and dead ends. Been there. Done that.

Keep in mind also that some of these pictures were updated to deal with little things sticking out like polished stainless fasteners v. black ones, etc.

The basis is here though.



And be prepared for Randy to jump in and tell you that the carbs mounted backwards on the Trans Am intake are wrong and should be reversed? Nothing yet as of the moment though. Wait. You'll see.


IF you re-read your copy and paste post just above, show me where in my procedure any of that was not done. Essentially that's "all" there is to it. A piece of cake.


I do want to see what Bob did on his 67 hood but if it is the simplest solution of just a flat base plate, that's gonna be a pretty big sucker?



Incidentally, the point of the cold air induction here is two fold. One as a sane street application but 2) the ability to remove the top COBRA plate and air filter at the strip.

That air cleaner assembly, although looking very cool is extremely restrictive, a rpm limiter and just removing it at a drag strip should show ET improvements in the 80 to 100 hp area, so 1 to two tenths.

On an original '67 500 air cleaner, you need to keep the base-plate fastened down with the top off to use it as ram air. Just the simple fact that the "factory" never did that shows they never even thought about even taking the air filter off for racing?

Here's a picture of what I mean. See the metal strips holding down the base plate?

[Bob Gaines]

I do want to see what Bob did on his 67 hood but if it is the simplest solution of just a flat base plate, that's gonna be a pretty big sucker?

I looked and can not find any pictures of the over the counter Shelby American ram air assembly . I will try to describe in words instead. The fiberglass base was wider the the stock base .It was made up with chop gun fiberglass. The outside edge of the base curved up towards the hood. The filter and stock duel four lid bolted down as normal. There was about a 2 inch space between the side of the filter element and the curved up sides of the base.   In my case the assembly came with a Shelby marked lid indicting it was a mid/ later 1967 time frame. The turned up edges of the base had a foam rubber seal on top of that edge around the top perimeter. The seal formed to the bottom of the hood when the hood closes. There was no modifications need to the hood. The assembly consisted of the ram air fiberglass base ,foam rubber seal,air filter element ,and diecast Shelby marked duel four lid.

[shelbydoug]

I do want to see what Bob did on his 67 hood but if it is the simplest solution of just a flat base plate, that's gonna be a pretty big sucker?

I looked and can not find any pictures of the over the counter Shelby American ram air assembly . I will try to describe in words instead. The fiberglass base was wider the the stock base .It was made up with chop gun fiberglass. The outside edge of the base curved up towards the hood. The filter and stock duel four lid bolted down as normal. There was about a 2 inch space between the side of the filter element and the curved up sides of the base.   In my case the assembly came with a Shelby marked lid indicting it was a mid/ later 1967 time frame. The turned up edges of the base had a foam rubber seal on top of that edge around the top perimeter. The seal formed to the bottom of the hood when the hood closes. There was no modifications need to the hood. The assembly consisted of the ram air fiberglass base ,foam rubber seal,air filter element ,and diecast Shelby marked duel four lid.

Thanks for trying. I think that I know how you feel. I have a lot of pics on slides that I haven't even looked at in more then 20 years.

The digital cameras help but I still need to organize them into files that I can find quickly.

At times it seems to be a lost cause but I still keep trying and I do appreciate the efforts that you put in to help. Thank you.


You can see in the Cleveland pictures that the R code base is rather narrow. Yours is significantly wider. I can't recall having ever seen one.

If you ever find those pictures, I would appreciate seeing them and I am sure others would as well.

[S7MS427]

Thanks for trying. I think that I know how you feel. I have a lot of pics on slides that I haven't even looked at in more then 20 years.

The digital cameras help but I still need to organize them into files that I can find quickly.

At times it seems to be a lost cause but I still keep trying and I do appreciate the efforts that you put in to help. Thank you.


You can see in the Cleveland pictures that the R code base is rather narrow. Yours is significantly wider. I can't recall having ever seen one.

If you ever find those pictures, I would appreciate seeing them and I am sure others would as well.

Doug - Ah, slides, yes.  Better than digital, they hold an amazing amount of detail.  If you don't mind putting in some time (which we all have tons of), spend a couple hundred bucks and buy a slide and negative scanner.  A 2400 dpi or thereabouts scan has a lot of detail.  Even 1200 dpi is pretty hi-rez.  I built the photo galleries on my website with scanned slides and negatives scanned at 4800.  Very happy with the result and takes me back to the early conventions whenever I look at them.  Good times, good times.

Bob - I also would like to see what you manage to dig up.

[shelbydoug]

Thanks for trying. I think that I know how you feel. I have a lot of pics on slides that I haven't even looked at in more then 20 years.

The digital cameras help but I still need to organize them into files that I can find quickly.

At times it seems to be a lost cause but I still keep trying and I do appreciate the efforts that you put in to help. Thank you.


You can see in the Cleveland pictures that the R code base is rather narrow. Yours is significantly wider. I can't recall having ever seen one.

If you ever find those pictures, I would appreciate seeing them and I am sure others would as well.

Doug - Ah, slides, yes.  Better than digital, they hold an amazing amount of detail.  If you don't mind putting in some time (which we all have tons of), spend a couple hundred bucks and buy a slide and negative scanner.  A 2400 dpi or thereabouts scan has a lot of detail.  Even 1200 dpi is pretty hi-rez.  I built the photo galleries on my website with scanned slides and negatives scanned at 4800.  Very happy with the result and takes me back to the early conventions whenever I look at them.  Good times, good times.

Bob - I also would like to see what you manage to dig up.

HA! Been there, done that!

My "trainer" says my hips ache now because I sit too much. We're talking into the hundreds of hours to do the transfers and that doesn't count the periods of "spilling my beer and crying into my pretzels" because of the sentimentality of seeing how young and pretty I WAS!