Intake vacuum fittings

[shelbydoug]

Also...to open the can further....please state whether your car has inboard or outboard brights to go along with the PCV / air cleaner nipple..

Son of a...female dog! You just had to bring that up right...

[67_1183]

My GT500 thermactor equipped car has the PCV to the intake.  The air cleaner fitting goes through a flame arrestor to the oil fill tube.

[Bob Gaines]

Which fitting, Bob? The Booster line and nipple is exactly what I have. They are not repros.

The last picture in reply #5 was added after I made my post. That fitting in the last picture is typical. It will have one or two vacuum ports that would be blocked off with rubber caps if on a 4 speed without A/C.  The pcv hose typically goes to the the air cleaner base on a assemblyline car unless it is thermactor equipped. If not showing concours and on a pleasure driven car the pcv to the intake may be a preferred arrangement.

[shelbydoug]

I was waiting for Bob to respond. This has been discussed here before. It is my understanding that for Concourse, the pcv hose goes to the air cleaner nipple.

It is Concourse because that's how the car was delivered new.

Functionally, it is questionable that it works at all with that design. To make the thing work as intended, it should go to the intake manifold.

In my view, the "original set up" (going to the air cleaner base) was a way of juggling the 2x4 system to keep the "expected owner complaints" of the carbs flooding, fouling the plugs, the difficulty in changing spark plugs and yet satisfy the emissions law of having a functional PCV system on the car.

Someone in the California DMV had to have determined that the connection to the air cleaner WAS acceptable to them and that it conformed to the requirements. There is no other possibility that I can see.

That's something that "Cantwell and team" would have contrived in order to provide a reduce cost solution to something that they already knew from pre-production testing.

In my view, these engines are going to last a lot longer with fewer issues by using a manifold connection BUT, that sucker is going to syphon in oil from the covers on long cruises.

I had a 302 small block, NEVER touched by me, COMPLETELY box stock, drain the oil pan on a cruise of about 200 miles. Ironically, it still showed oil pressure, but NOTHING on the dip stick.

This is VERY typical in my view of the FORD PCV connection design. Personally, I now plumb in an oil separator tank into all of my systems. The 67 GT500 definitely needs one if you are going to the intake manifold.

[1967 eight barrel]

As we all know there is not enough vacuum in the air cleaner to ever make the PCV function.  As Bob stated, it's certainly an asset to have a functional PCV for moisture reasons.
                                                                               -Keith

[shelbydoug]

As we all know there is not enough vacuum in the air cleaner to ever make the PCV function.  As Bob stated, it's certainly an asset to have a functional PCV for moisture reasons.
                                                                               -Keith

I agree. The original set up never worked.

It isn't just for moisture only though. A functioning PCV system is worth in the vicinity of 25hp since it helps seal the lower piston ring. Vacuum over 12 inches becomes destructive since many of the engine seals can't take that much negative pressure. A crank seal will literally get sucked into the engine. 8 to 10 inches is about ideal. BUT that's gonna' suck in excessive oil into the intake. You need a separator to reduce that. Call it an oil scrapper if you want to. Same thing.

Even cars with open breathers are using them to run high speed events on open track days to satisfy track safety rules. You'd be surprised how much oil they catch!

Just look at the location of the vacuum fitting. It is below the level of the pcv valve. You're going to get a fluid flow there.

You could also look at it as an open vent system is giving away 25hp and causing excessive piston ring wear.


I will also add that my power brake hook up looks like the last pic in #5.

[rcgt350]

Is it typical to attach the red and white PCV tag around it on the right valve cover.? GT350

[Bob Gaines]

Is it typical to attach the red and white PCV tag around it on the right valve cover.? GT350

Yes , but only on service pcv's not on assemblyline.

[jswoody]

I was waiting for Bob to respond. This has been discussed here before. It is my understanding that for Concourse, the pcv hose goes to the air cleaner nipple.

It is Concourse because that's how the car was delivered new.

Functionally, it is questionable that it works at all with that design. To make the thing work as intended, it should go to the intake manifold.

In my view, the "original set up" (going to the air cleaner base) was a way of juggling the 2x4 system to keep the "expected owner complaints" of the carbs flooding, fouling the plugs, the difficulty in changing spark plugs and yet satisfy the emissions law of having a functional PCV system on the car.

Someone in the California DMV had to have determined that the connection to the air cleaner WAS acceptable to them and that it conformed to the requirements. There is no other possibility that I can see.

That's something that "Cantwell and team" would have contrived in order to provide a reduce cost solution to something that they already knew from pre-production testing.

In my view, these engines are going to last a lot longer with fewer issues by using a manifold connection BUT, that sucker is going to syphon in oil from the covers on long cruises.

I had a 302 small block, NEVER touched by me, COMPLETELY box stock, drain the oil pan on a cruise of about 200 miles. Ironically, it still showed oil pressure, but NOTHING on the dip stick.

This is VERY typical in my biew of the FORD PCV connection design. Personally, I now plumb in an oil separator tank into all of my systems. The 67 GT500 definitely needs one if you are going to the intake manifold.

Thank you to everyone for all of the information and discussion.  How many use an oil separator tank, and are there any recommendations of a particular tank for a 428 pi? 

[shelbydoug]

I was waiting for Bob to respond. This has been discussed here before. It is my understanding that for Concourse, the pcv hose goes to the air cleaner nipple.

It is Concourse because that's how the car was delivered new.

Functionally, it is questionable that it works at all with that design. To make the thing work as intended, it should go to the intake manifold.

In my view, the "original set up" (going to the air cleaner base) was a way of juggling the 2x4 system to keep the "expected owner complaints" of the carbs flooding, fouling the plugs, the difficulty in changing spark plugs and yet satisfy the emissions law of having a functional PCV system on the car.

Someone in the California DMV had to have determined that the connection to the air cleaner WAS acceptable to them and that it conformed to the requirements. There is no other possibility that I can see.

That's something that "Cantwell and team" would have contrived in order to provide a reduce cost solution to something that they already knew from pre-production testing.

In my view, these engines are going to last a lot longer with fewer issues by using a manifold connection BUT, that sucker is going to syphon in oil from the covers on long cruises.

I had a 302 small block, NEVER touched by me, COMPLETELY box stock, drain the oil pan on a cruise of about 200 miles. Ironically, it still showed oil pressure, but NOTHING on the dip stick.

This is VERY typical in my biew of the FORD PCV connection design. Personally, I now plumb in an oil separator tank into all of my systems. The 67 GT500 definitely needs one if you are going to the intake manifold.

Thank you to everyone for all of the information and discussion.  How many use an oil separator tank, and are there any recommendations of a particular tank for a 428 pi?

There is no pre-existing separator "kit". You have to design it. Decide where to put it. How to plumb it, etc. Most people are running without them. Most people don't drive the car much or very far, just basically around the block a few times.

[Wedgeman]

Would love to see your design ...Doug !!....

[shelbydoug]

Would love to see your design ...Doug !!....

Everything is apart. Might have it together again this week? Temps are up to a human level again. I didn't take pics when it was together. Ya' gotta' wait a little bit.

At the moment it's like Scarecrow, with a little over here...a little over there.

I can show you the Pantera if you wanna' see that one but no 427 Wedgie in that one? That one is together.

[Wedgeman]

Excellent !!

[shelbydoug]

Excellent !!

OK. You asked for it, you got it.

This is how I accomplished this in my Pantera. The same tank is being used in my Shelby's. It is billet aluminum. It has a sight tube on the side that will show what is in the tank and a petcock underneath at the bottom to drain it.

It is plumbed between the pcv valve and the vacuum source. In the case of the Pantera it is a vacuum reservoir made out of a Mr. Gasket fuel log. It was used because it fits so conveniently just behind the stainless header heat shield. It isn't showing up well because of the lighting but it's there, plumbed in series to the individual stainless tubing coming from each of the intake runners.
It's a Weber manifold so it's an individual runner manifold and just to get engine vacuum you need to plumb them together.

I think the pictures pretty much explain what is going on with it. The oil that gets sucked in just drops to the bottom of the tank and a minimal amount gets sucked into the intake manifold. It's not 100% efficient, but is highly efficient, or maybe...good enough for my purposes.


The Shelbys are using the same tank. In my '68 GT350, the battery is in the trunk. That provides enough room against the front of the right shock tower to mount the tank. In that application, the tank is plumbed with -6 Russell braided stainless hose from the pcv to the back of the intake manifold.

The intake there is a C60A, 2x4 Holley Trans-Am intake. It's got only one vacuum port and that's at the back up against the fire wall. So what you will see is a gaggle of braided stainless hose for the pcv, the fuel line and the heater hoses all occupying the same space between the back of the valve cover and the intake manifold.

I tell you this so that you can choose to avert your eyes from a completely non-stock assembly and consider praying for me at the alter of Concourse only worship, asking for my forgiveness? I'd appreciate that.


I always hesitate to post pics like that not only to avoid the accusations of blasphemy but in addition to criticisms of why I used blue hose ends vs. pink or purple and why I feel the necessity to be so overly machismo. I tend to ignore those comments these days and just rack that up to those who have choosen to check "other" on their California drivers licenses rather than male or female, or should that be mail or femail? Hum? Another alternative I suppose.

Well anyway, here's the Pantera. You'll get the idea. The parts are all here for the '67 500 but I have no idea exactly the details of where the plumbing will be located or even the tank. Evey place I try, I come back the next day and nix it. There is FAR less room in that engine compartment then the '68 350's.

I keep trying to go Akashic but so far the Akashic Records have not offered me any kind of solution. That's disturbing. One would have thought that in the total time of the Universe that stems from before time existed, some creature somewhere would have come up with a solution and shared it? Maybe that was the part about "get a horse", I don't know? 



What's with the picture feature here? Three of the four got rotated 90 to the left? Do we have Russian hackers here? I thought that they only twisted things to the right? 

[shelbydoug]

EarlJ is also using an oil separator in his "R". His is an open breather system, so it's not vacuum powered and is actually a "catch can".

He could pick up around 25hp by going to a pcv system.


Here is the way I did it on my 68 GT350. Hose runs to the pcv and tubing runs to the an extended vacuum t from the back of the manifold. Tubing takes less space then the hose and firmly plants itself in place. Lots of plumbing going on in that immediate area and space is at a premium.